WHEATON GROUP B Full Y “ELITE” Results and discussion
Posted on November 2, 2014 Leave a Comment
Well it was a long time coming, but worth the wait.
ANCIENT CONNECTIONS
First of all a little review. We have been standing at R-U152 L2* for a long time. Even with a Walk Through the Y we failed to yield any downstream (closer to present) SNPS although we did turn up one private SNP for Jerry. The Y ELITE has yielded 2 BRAND NEW shared SNPS FGC22501 and FGC22538. We also have an additional 33 highest quality private SNPS and 11 very high quality and 1 high highest Quality insertion. These are all possible candidates for further testing within the group.
I have re-computed the GD (genetic Distance or variation in STR markers) and the DOOTZ is -21 GD (genetic distance)
46/67 with WHEATON Group B. DOOTZ has done a Big Y at FTDNA. The anonymous Mexican sample is actually someone with 3 of 4 grandparents born in Mexico so not sure where the other 1/4 is from ( Maybe Spanish/Portuguese origins) is from the 1000 Genomes Project and a data set without identifying information.
L2 is estimated at about 5,175 YBP (years before present) My very rough estimate based on STRS is about 2450 YBP (450 BC) for FGC22538 although it could be further back than that. I will update if I get better information on that.[See 4th map for spread during this time frame] This map shows the spread of the “celtic” Bell Beakers. If you follow the River Danube to its Terminus tat the Black Sea you are in Romania.
Map of Bell Beakers 3000-1500 BC from Britain Begins by Cunnliffe
Bell beaker sites and Migrations from Britain Begins
Bell Beaker Pottery and Migrations from Ancestral Journey’s by Jean Manco
Note on the above map the small bits of beaker sites in SW Wales.
Spread of Italic-Celtic language by 500 BC from Ancestral Journeys
Compare the above map with the distribution of U152 (aka S28) the parent of L2
At this point a lot of the origin is speculative. My hunch is that the Danube River is the pathway from the Alpine region of current day Italy/Austria to Romania and our closet match. So whoever was our common ancestor probably started there in the Alps and ours migrated northward and across to the British Isles and plains of Salisbury (Stonehenge) or took a maritime route going through the Mediterranean and up along the coast of Iberia and made its way to the Bristol Channel.
One expert said “If you find other FGC22501+ FGC22538+ in France and Bretagne then your ancestors may have come in prehistoric times or even Romans times. However, if there is FGC22501+ FGC22538+ only in Germany and Central Europe then it means that your ancestors came to Britain with the Saxons.”
We will now have to sit back and wait for more matches but the heavy lifting is done in terms of where we fit in the great human Y-TREE. As more data collects and when we get more matches we will be able to answer these questions better.
GROUP B POSSIBILITIES FOR FUTURE TESTING
Since the SNPS shared are certain to be shared by all of us in the group there is no real need to test for either unless you are just dying to. They would need to be requested of FTDNA or YSEQ to do so. Although we know FGC22538 is tested in the BIG Y and FGC22501 is not. My next step may be to request an evaluation of the Private SNPS to see what kind of panel could be developed at YSEQ. Their current costs of panels range from $88 to $359. My guess is ours would be at the upper end. Other possibility is I am checking with Full genomes on the coverage/availability of their Y Prime. If this is an option it might be the ultimate cheapest route. The other option is take a shot in the dark and test a few SNPs—-of the roughly 45 the majority would be shared among all group members.Then it gets down to parsing who has which one—the ultimate clues to those where we do not know how they connect.
Please feel free to weigh in with thoughts and comments.
What’s coming for Group B and a Review for Everyone Else
Posted on July 20, 2014 Leave a Comment
REVIEW
Group C is way ahead with Results of a Big Y and Full Genomes in hand. Their nomenclature looks something like this R1b>U106> L48>Z346>DF101>DF102>FGC12993. Each of those numbers represents a one time SNP (mutation) carried by everyone descended from that individual in which the SNP occurred. Okay you are saying so what? Well the what is how each group of researchers is working on their part of the massive Y Human family tree. For Group C they are wonderfully close to unraveling very old connections between Irish & Scottish KINCAIDs, Scottish SINCLAIRs and a German FRENCKNICK. Imagine a day when you can with a few SNP tests or a simple panel know where exactly on the Y-Tree and how that relates to all other men on the planet. Not only where but how he came to be there. A little review.
Starting with the first man “Adam” one of his descendents had a mutation on the Y chromosome which led to Haplogroup B and then a descendent of B had a mutation C, D, E etc. All of our WHEATON groups so far belong to either “R” of “I” haplogroup which are the most common in Great Britain. I’ve shown you this chart before. Wheadon Group C parts ways with the rest of the WHEATON groups about 5,000 years ago when a man was born with the U106 mutation. Around the same was another M269 man who developed a different mutation this one called P312.
Of our other WHEATON groups
Groups A & D are L21 the most prolific in Great Britain accounting for 23.5% of men in GB. The highest frequencies are found in SW Ireland and Wales. Group C U106 are about 14.8% in GB with the highest concentrations in Southern England especially the East.
GROUP B
Group B U152 is only about 4.3% of men in GB and L2 (the son of U152) accounts for only 1.8%. Then we add into the mix of the L2’s sons (downstream SNPS) are the major subgroups Z49, L20, Z36, Z56 etc for which Group B is NEGATIVE for all. These account for the vast majority of L2’s. So that leaves us with a small subset of men probably less than .5% who are L2* and negative on all the above SNPS in GB. The highest concentrations of L2* outside of GB are in the NE corner of Italy (Dolomite region). So the likely L2* homeland. Terry sent this link.
Those of you who are interested in the ultimate origins of L2 Please see this article “U152 in Italy – Boattini et al. (2013) Which has a couple of awesome charts. In the Treviso area of Italy (NE corner) the concentration of L2’s as a percentage of U152 reaches 80%!!!! [R-U152 and G-M201 being the most frequent overall.] So this is the likely origin of the WHEATON Group B. The next question is how did it get to England and Wales? U152 is estimated at about 4,925 YBP (Years Before Present) say 5,000 YBP. And L2 at 5,175 YBP (but it must be below)so let’s say 4,800 YBP. Major subgroup of L2 namely Z49 comes in about 4,700 years ago. Fast forward Next Generation Sequencing like Big Y and Full Y.
In the last 6 months those who were previously L2* (that is negative for known downstream SNPS) are gaining new names due to Next Generation Sequencing. Below is my abbreviated list of new SNPS and what to note. The top two testers have no matches on the 20-40 New SNPS identified in their Full Genome Sequences. This could happen to us too! So they must wait for a match—matches that are from different surnames and with a GD (genetic Distance) greater than a few (STR) markers are then moved from the category “private SNPS’ to Public—that is representing a group extending beyond a family or surnames. FOWLER FTDNA N114738 is of interest because of his Physical proximity to the DEVON-SOMERSET- SW WALES. EATON FTDNA 125963 because of the the similarity of name and English origins. However there are a couple of wildcards in the mix so far. One is SIMONETTI FTDNA N68796 who is from the heart of SE Italy and whose tree stretches back to the 1600’s. He is the closest GD at 37 makers at 24/37. He also has a couple of our unusual off modal values. The next one to watch is HANNI FTDNA 171601 from Algeria who is 22/37. Terry Mallenby suggested an interesting story line should we share a downstream SNP with HANNI:
“I might mention, an interesting German “king” Barbarossa [“red beard”] was involved in campaigns in Northern Italy – and his brother was a Barbary Pirate – I remember one of your messages mentioned “slaves” captured by such pirates? Wouldn’t it be ironic if the Ladin isolated populations in the Dolomite region are related somehow, a small group made it to U.K. regions [Group B Wheaton], and were later captured as slaves by such pirates – and all the time related via Barbarossa’s campaigns in Italy?
If the match is with SIMONETTI we will than need to find out whether the common ancestor was some 3-4,000 YBP and thus an early migrant into GB or only around 1900 YBP and our Group B progenitor was actually a roman soldier from the Ladin speaking region of the Dolomites.
More about Alpine Regiments of the Roman Army.
Map of Roman forts in Wales here.
If we were playing the odds the greatest number have been DF103 positive and they are wildly scattered suggesting an early SNP and widely dispersed. I promised an interesting ride and I just wanted to let you all in on what has been happening. Hopefully we will have some real news to report in the next few months. Should we prove positive for DF103, FGC10543, DF90 or DF110 I believe they are all available at FTDNA and YSEQ. At that point if we match one of those we will probably want to confirm with one other of you. Then it will be on to testing other downstream SNPS looking to refine the tree. FINGERS CROSSED we match someone already tested! There’s a story in here somewhere and we are going to FIND IT!
No Matches Yet—but of interest
FOWLER FTDNA N114738 (FGC 2QAKU) Somerset, England
EATON FTDNA 125963 Kent, England
FGC4183 / DF103 (widespread)
BARTOLD FTDNA N81364 Germany
CRAUSS Germany FGC E5G8W
2 Anonymous UK
4 Anonymous Netherlands
CASTELLI FTDNA N115394 Italy
SIMONETTI FTDNA N68796 Italy
HARRISON FTDNA 293471 England
FGC 10543 Italy
ROCCA FTDNA N90341 (FGC 22S11)
FIERA FTDNA 207656
SIMONETTI FTDNA B3593
FGC 5336 Italy
POTONARIUS FTDNA E11688
CTS5689 Slovakia
ROKURT FTDNA 236148 Slovakia
DF110 Germany & England
BARTON FTDNA 19736 England
FINCKE FTDNA170376 Germany
WILSONN FTDNA 148338 England
FOWLER FTDNA 152091England
ESKEW FTDNA N52049 England
DF90 Algeria & Poland
HANNI FTDNA 171601 Algeria
GRIEPENTROG FTDNA N91083 Pomerania
7426675 Luxembourg
ARMSTRONG FTDNA 126817 US
SCHREINER FTDNA 73624 Luxembourg
6707762 Scotland England?
HAY FTDNA 34451
VANCE FTDNA 128853
TAYLOR FTDNA 92511
JOHNSTON FTDNA 4818
Latest
Posted on January 25, 2014 1 Comment
How does it feel to discover a long-lost cousin? I can tell you – it feels fantastic. I discovered the first in DowlandChurch, when chatting to an elderly lady who was arranging the flowers for a wedding; she turned out to be my mother’s cousin. I discovered the next on the notice board at the Royal College of Music – well, it’s a long story. That was Geoffrey, my first cousin whom I had never met. And now, Geoffrey and I have discovered that we are closely linked to Kingsley Wheaton, descendant of Thomas, who married Mary Sheener in Brixham 300 years ago. And this time the proof lay in their DNA tests which showed a very close relationship – as Kelly puts it below:
In comparing Y-DNA25 markers, which show 0 mismatches, the probability that (237132) Mr. Kingsley Wheaton and (237133) Rev. Geoffrey Wheaton shared a common ancestor within the last…
4 generation is 61.17%
8 generations is 84.92%
12 generations is 94.15%
16 generations is 97.73%
20 generations is 99.12%
24 generations is 99/66%
From my researches, backed up by Jean, with such a close match, Kingsley’s ancestor has to be the Thomas who was born to Samuel Wheaton and baptised in WinkleighParishChurch on 29th August 1693. Although Samuel and Margaret ffarley, his wife, had three other children, all baptized in Winkleigh, we do not know what happened after that. Obviously, Thomas eventually ended up in Brixham, a distance of some 35-40 miles from Winkleigh.
Samuel was the elder brother of my ancestor Lewis, both sons of Nathaniel Wheaton, baptized in Coldridge on 14th June 1640. In turn, Nathaniel was the son of Nathaniel, born c. 1605, to Paul Wheaton and Joan Slee, and probably descended from Andrew Wheaton of Eggesford. Unfortunately, thanks to Adolf and his Baedeker raids, the wills and other documents for Andrew went up in smoke. But since Paul’s second son was named Andrew – not a common name in Wheaton circles, it is a pretty reasonable.bet.
We appear to have made the 11th generation: Paul, Nathaniel, Nathaniel, Lewis (and Samuel), Nathaniel, Thomas, John, William, William Bradford, Ernest and Edith, Geoffrey and Susan; if we cheekily add Andrew of Eggesford, then we are at the 94.15%. Get out the champagne. And for goodness sake, encourage any other Wheatons to get their DNA tested; somewhere there is buried treasure.
Almost Halloween! Latest news.
Posted on October 26, 2013 2 Comments
RESULTS
Congrats to Roger who joins our growing Group B cluster. Roger’s 12 marker test was a perfect match to our Group B modal. He plans on upgrading at the sale next month. His closest match should be Bill (William Miel) as they share the same Robert 1, John 2, James 3 lineage. This makes a total of 16 results (a couple not at FTDNA).
We are waiting for results for Howell Wheaton due next month to see if he matches Group E. Fingers crossed.
We are also awaiting results for Keith Whidden whose family traces back to Buckfast, DEVON, England. So who knows whether this will tie an existing Wheaton group to the Whiddens or make someone in the Whidden project very happy. This family is not proven to be related to the knighted Whiddens but the proximity is there. See the Wheaton map here .
SALE USUALLY IS ANNOUNCED AT the
FTDNA CONFERENCE
Anyone who is at 12 markers or who would like to upgrade this would be a good time to do it. If any of you would like to grow the project overall you can always purchase a $49 kit and give it to the next WHEATON you meet. With thousands worldwide we should be able to get a few more tested 😉
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GROUP B TESTING
In other news the WHEATON Group B folks have generously donated funds to pay for a complete Y sequence for our modal David J. We are awaiting a likely announcement at the FTDNA conference Nov 8-10. I have it from a good source ,
Bennett [FTDNA President] said that you should wait if you want to save money. Thomas [Krahn who did the work on the Walk Through the Y] told me that he developed a new Y sequencing method for FTDNA before he was fired and that they will be announcing it at the conference.
I am not sure which way we will go until details are released. It may be that we want to do one or more of the FTDNA product in lieu of the Full sequence and or use part of the funds for SNP testing. The one thing that would make it better is to have it all under one roof at FTDNA. I will be in touch with those that donated seeking their permission if I switch to testing at FTDNA. In the event we go that way I will make a donation to FTDNA in the amount of the funds collected and then I will authorize release of funds to pay for appropriate testing. We are still awaiting 5 results from other L2’s who have Full Sequencing on order.
HAPPY HALLOWEEN to all.
Welcome to Our Newest Members
Posted on September 18, 2013 Leave a Comment
We have gained three new members in the past week! Welcome to the group.
Regarding Group B Relationships
WHEATON: Allegedly came from England (or less likely Wales) c. 1636 to Salem, MA Married a BOWEN allegedly from Glamorgan, Wales There were several births/deaths recorded in 1601-2 in Flemingston, Glamorgan, Wales for WHEATONS.
HOWELL(s): Traced back from Southern US to Newport, Monmouth, Wales and from there to Neath, Glamorgan, Wales late 1700’s. A branch of this HOWELL family migrated from Newport to Stockton, Durham Co, England Joh
MALLENBY: Lived in Stockton, Durham Co and Northumberland, England. Lived in Stockton at same time as HOWELL and Raine. Ran a boarding house and both HOWELL and MALLENBY worked in Ironworks/ ship building. There was a John Raine living in the boarding house during one census.
RAINES: Lived in Merthyr Tydfil, Glamorgan, Wales same time as HOWELL and later found in Stockton, Durham, England same time frame same occupation as HOWELL and MALLENBY.
HANCOCK: Late immigrant to US via Canada. Originally from So. Molton, Devon. I have traced from So. Molton to Dolton, Devon in 1700’s. However the immigrant traveled widely and married a HOWELLS from Newport, Monmouth, Wales.
I am pretty confident that at least to the 1600’s this is the right spot. And if I look at the closest match to the Wheaton Group B cluster is a Griffith WILLIAMS. I do not have to look very hard to place a ton of Griffith WILLIAMS in Glamorgan (a bit like John Smith). There is one buried in Swansea, Glamorgan 11 Jan 1730. And an earlier one buried in Llandeilo, Talybont (near Swansea) in 1671. I would guess the Moses Wright (another distant match in L2) would similarly tie in to Wales so I am leaning in that direction. I still cannot prove where Robert Wheaton came from. I do have a Robert Weadon who marries in 1599 in Stogursey, Somerset. He is another possibility for Robert’s father but as always remains speculative. I have updated the location to Minehead for Robert’s origins as the approximate average of his origins, however it might be anywhere along the north coastline of Devon, Somerset or South Glamorgan. I can definitely find nothing that would pull him as far south as Exeter as I had originally expected.
So here we are back in Devon and Glamorgan again!
Happy Birthday to Jerry our oldest member 92 on September 12th
Posted on September 12, 2013 Leave a Comment
Happy BIRTHDAY
Looks like we have some longevity genes working in our favor! Happy Birthday to Jerry a wonderful and active member of our group!
And we have reached our 2 1/2 year birthday for the Wheaton DNA Project with 46 members. We still have two Free DNA kits available for new members with Wheaton surname of recent British origin OR proven descendents surnamed Wheaton of John 2 Wheadon, Obadiah 2 Wheaton or Chistopher 1 Wheaton of Hull, MA.
SALEM, MA Disappointment
After waiting three months for requested copies of the original Robert Wheaton records in Salem I received transcriptions of transcriptions. I had sent transcriptions that I had an very explicit instructions but apparently the clerks in Salem can’t read! Anyone living near Salem wanting an assignment, please contact me.
RESULTS
No new results are pending for the first time since we started.
EXCITING DEVELOPMENTS IN Y-DNA
There is a fairly new player in the DNA market called Britains DNA. They are offering the most extensive YDNA test (15,000 Y markers) in the business except for the complete Y. http://www.britainsdna.com/products/complete
The complete Y-DNA which is over $1,200 is in beta testing and there are FOUR R-L2 (Like our GROUP B) kits included with results expected at the end of the month. If these should yield any new SNPs those are ones we should test as well. I was actually considering ordering a test for my husband from Britains DNA in hopes of finding a new downstream SNP of L2. I have asked around and people are saying it is the best Y value out there. I will wait to see what existing kits in the pipeline turn up.
Mostly quiet —-new Beginners Guide
Posted on August 21, 2013 Leave a Comment
Labor Day is just around the corner and lest you think I have not been busy I want to share with you one of the projects I have been up to. Some of you are aware of my attempts here and on my web site to provide you with information relevant to interpreting your DNA results.
I also belong to several DNA mailing lists including a DNA for Newbies group. A frequent complaint is the lack of easy to understand information for Newbies. A book is the works by several well known genetic genealogists but it is at least two years away from publication. Several of us talked about doing a collective project and then I just sat down and started one. It is called the Beginner’s Guide to Genetic Genealogy and I have 8 Lessons so far. If you are someone you know might be interested please pass the word. It is a work in progress and probably contains my usual typos etc. More will be added as I am able. Hope any of you who are interested find it worthwhile.
Kelly
Is it a Bird is it a Plane?
Posted on July 16, 2013 Leave a Comment
What is it? Well it is a Fluxus Network showing the relationship between Wheaton Group B members at 111 markers. This or the one below do not show the markers that have multiple values as they are fast mutating. The black numbers refer to Kit numbers. So there are 5 kits at 67 markers with essentially the same value
This is the same group at 67 markers. The big Yellow Circle includes: Glenn 78935, David J 200230, Jerry 204842, & Larry Wheaton 200373 and Dan HANCOCK 2333832. It also shows that Adam 233653 is closer to the big circle than Don HOWELL 131313 or Larry RAINES 141309 but are all on the same branch. Thomas MALLENBY N101982 is close to the center as well. Interestingly these are the two Welsh ancestral lines. Outliers are my hubby Michael 199087, Paul Ritchie 261919. But if you look at the first 111 marker Network you can see the effect of more markers on the relationship. This moves Thomas MALLENBY to an outlier along with Michael and to a lesser extent Dan HANCOCK.
Okay I really am a geek!
Robert Wheaton Descendants and a tidbit for New Brunswick: Book Reccomendation
Posted on July 13, 2013 1 Comment
I had previously shared with you that the following was due to be published in June.
Series edited by: William H. Brackney With: Charles H. Hartman
Product Code: H871
ISBN: 9780881464399
476 pages
Binding Information: Hardback
Available from Amazon for $51.00 http://www.amazon.com/Baptists-America-Swansea-Massachusetts-America-Baptist/dp/0881464392
I received my copy two days ago and I love it. It is absolutely essential for anyone descended from Robert’s son Ephraim. This book contains the transcription of all of his parish notes for the 16 years he was their minister. As well as those of John Myles and others. It’s insight into the life and times of our Rehoboth and Swansea ancestors is magnificent. Many folks like Ephraim lived in Rehoboth or Seekonk but worshiped not far away in Swansea. But that is not all there is detailed coverage of John Myles in Wales and with part of his flock in Barnstaple, DEVON! Some of the same places we see in WHEATON Group B crop up here and there which only strengthens my belief that there was a connection that predates the Baptist formation at Ilston.
On the New Brunswick front on page lxxxv
Nathan Mason (1726-1804) who with Charles Seamans, journeyed to New Brunswick where, at the settlement called Sackville in the region of Trantramar, and commenced the first congregation in what is now Canada in 1763.”
I hope that it is becoming clearer why I have spent so much time following the Baptists as they are the likely catalyst for many of the movements of Group B Wheatons from one place to another. We know for a fact that Robert’s son Samuel had 3 sons and upon his death his wife Elizabeth WOOD married his cousin Samuel BOWEN and they with two of the sons followed the Rev. Timothy Brooks to Hopewell township, New Jersey where the Cohansey Baptist Church was formed.
So although the above book is an ecclesiastical history it is also a day to day insight into the lives of the Early Baptists of Rehoboth and their interconnected web with Baptists in Ireland, England, Wales Canada and across the colonies. Many Rehoboth families are listed. I am happy to do look ups to let you know if your folks are mentioned.
As a side note I was quite surprised to be mentioned in the footnotes 3 times from my “Conjectures on the Origins of the Wheatons and the Bowens of Rehoboth and Their Likely Baptist Roots.”
Regards!
And the more challenging Results but still good…
Posted on July 13, 2013 Leave a Comment
Thomas a descendant of Edwin or Edward Wheaton of Newfoundland got his 12 marker result back and it does not exactly match anyone in the project so far. However it is a possible 11/12 match with our long time member Willard Wheaton whose line hits a brick wall in Philadelphia and NJ. But here’s where it gets a little more interesting…..I ran Thomas’ matches and he has hundreds at the 12 marker level but here’s what was interesting he has two perfect matches with men surnamed HEATON and ten with men surnamed EATON. Now I don’t know about you but that really caught my eye. So I have suggested that he expand his markers to see if his match holds together with Willard and/Or the HEATONS or EATONs. This very well could be another of those name change situations where someone dropped or added letters over time. Stay tuned on this one.
Wheaton Wood 
